Monday, December 03, 2018

Gun-grabbing geezers redux

More evidence gun grabbers are disproportionately geriatric (or in the case of David Hogg, have the bone density of the average geezer) from Reuters-Ipsos:

Age ranges per generational cohort are 18-26 for Zurs, 27-38 for Millennials, 39-53 for Xers, and 54-71 for Boomers. For the purpose of obtaining adequate sample sizes, Zurs thus also include the youngest Millennials according to the conventional cutoffs. 

The total respondent pool isn't large enough to break down by both age and race, but non-whites are less supportive of gun rights than whites. Once race is taken into account, the generational gun-grabbing gap becomes larger still. No demographic is more pro-gun than young white men are. Molon Labe!


thekrustykurmudgeon said...

looking at it as a racial issue is wrong. Blacks love guns - the difference is that they tend to get them via the black market (no pun intended) and use them for violence/intimidation rather than for hunting.

The real divide is between urban/suburban whites and exurban/rural whites. Whites with college degree or more went dem this election by eight points while those without went GOP by 20. My guess is that that's basically coterminous with guns vs no guns.

IHTG said...

Umm, I think this particular question may have an element of self-interest...

Toddy Cat said...

This is the most encouraging thing this Second-Amendment loving second-stage Boomer has read in a long time. If there is hope, it lies in the "Z"'s

Toddy Cat said...

Thanks, Mr. Fawzy, but I don't need any furniture transported to or from Khobar

Anonymous said...

I wonder what role is played by the early deaths of white men in the figure for Boomers and by now even Gen X.

Bearing in mind that "Baby Boomer" was a marketing research innovation (advertising based on culturally constructed chronological slices), those called "Boomers" will rapidly become feminized in both sex ratios and culture/behaviors, as older women outlive men in general, plus as the male-early-death trend establishes itself as many missing Boomer males.

These females will also likely be more urban, as will anyone over 60 at this point.

The labor of rural life--which correlates strongly with a non-hive mentality, including tool use and personal responsibility for safety/security--is a younger person's game. Bales, chainsaws, and timber winches get a little heavier to lift/use/mount each year. Bouncing back from the ills flesh inherits from physical labor in the elements takes longer.

Those of us genetically selected for this sort of thing end up doing it for a longer span of longer lives. But in general as women age, and survive, in part because they didn't, in general, do this hard labor, nor die as a result of it, or perhaps they did it and became similarly disabled but still live longer, then they lean more toward the state being their protector and/or choosing urban settings in old age. (This also may correspond to the early deaths of males including sons/sons in law who might in previous generations have provided a multigenerational home for elders.)

This urbanization of elderhood makes biological sense for females who never formed attachments to a protector male, or lost one in the pursuit of that labor, or, having once been "country wives" simply grow weary of the niggling regulations piled upon the law abiding in the pursuit of RKBA. (Which is what I see as a trainer and mentor.) Just as they grew weary of regulations on their farms/land/forest.

That is, after all, one of the purposes of "gun" "control"--to make exercising the right so onerous and expensive that law-abiding people give it up, ceding the ground to the criminal, whose criminality we will have with us always, supplying endless good growing weather for the House of "Gun" "Control."

The overlords of the lucrative human hive are not comfortable with tool mastery and tool use in general. As a trainer and mentor, seeing the robust enthusiasm for 2A among people 30 and under is one of the things that makes me wake up smiling. How can you keep them down in the hive, when they've been to the open range/gravel pit!?


216 said...


Some have noted the absence of the phrase "remittance tax" in Trump pronouncements. Does anyone think that Mnuchin has wormtonged Trump into thinking it isn't possible? This angle seems to have been ignored, most anger has concentrated on Nielsen or on Congress.

Lance E said...

The differences aren't really that huge, though. Even among the most gun-friendly demographic, only 30% oppose further restrictions. That ain't good.

Just for fun, I'd like to see this plotted against upper-body strength.

Audacious Epigone said...


The gun gap is huge even at the state level so you're probably correct. On the other hand, rural areas are older than urban ones are. Take away is there really is no evidence that David Hogg is anything close to representative of the sentiments of Gen Z.


Touche, though that doesn't explain why the trend continues all the way through to geezers.

Toddy Cat,

Behavioral freedom is huge with Gen Z. I'm less certain about intellectual freedom (and neither of those are intended to be moral assessments, either).


I've not heard or seen that regarding younger people living more in rural areas. Maybe to some extent among those doing menial labor, but a lot of American farmers are older. This shows up pretty clearly in electoral patterns, too, with older/rural counties going red and younger/urban counties going blue.


Good question. Where is Stephen Miller on this? Why doesn't Trump talk to Ann Coulter from time to time?

Lance E,

True, though coupled with the increasing neotenous trend in the West, it's not that surprising. More encouraging is yet another example of there not only being no tendency for young people to be gun-grabbers relative to fogies, the opposite is actually the case.

Random Dude on the Internet said...

A potential devil's advocate explanation is that boomers are more trusting that a government can have exceptions for items like mental health and the younger people are, the more distrusting they are in government. The average zoomer knows that the government, combined with an out of control judiciary, can turn a mental health exception into a blanket ban because a judge ruled that all white men are deemed mentally deficient and therefore cannot own guns. Such a scenario is considered incomprehensible to someone born in a high trust society. Zoomers know the risk so they don't even want to broach the possibility.

216 said...


He must think Ann Coulter is Ivanka's troll account.


Hard to say about Miller, his background is legislative, not sure that he has expertise in accounting/finance.

Anonymous said...

Hi! Recent-ish reader here. Eastern Europe represent!
Can you please make this type of graph more "logical" looking please? The "More united"/"More divided" should be on the sides and the "Staying the same" should be in the middle as though these were human heights.
This way it will better show just how fucking crap right-wingers/republicans/conservatives are on pretty much every issue relative to the leftists. An antifa could punch them in the mouth and they still won't be 100% against them; they'll still reserve 5/10/20% thinking for "What if I did something wrong to him?".

Just a little bugaboo of mine. Thanks!

Random Dude on the Internet said...

> Good question. Where is Stephen Miller on this? Why doesn't Trump talk to Ann Coulter from time to time?

It appears that Trump values loyalty and gut feelings above all else. He likely trusts Jared and Ivanka more than Miller or Coulter. Say what you will about Obama but he always made an effort to take care of his friends. Trump pretty much ignores his right wing base and tries (and fails) to appease the left. It's shameful but I don't expect anything different at this point.

216 said...

o/t UK

Watch out, Sadiq Khan is biding his time until he will dispatch Corbyn.

Dan said...

Right. The question is should young people have less rights. As a 40 year old I kind of think so, heh.

Audacious Epigone said...

Random Dude,

Yes, I think there is something to the idea of a reflexive distrust of institutions among Zs that is driving a lot of social trends.

And there is probably also something to the idea that Trump feels disrespected by fellow elites to such an extent that he'll stir up the rabble to punish them for ignoring him. Underlying this reading of his behavior, of course, is that it is their approval rather than that of his base that he is most motivated by.


But he gave some solid rally warmups during the campaign season and he's naturally polemical. His advice can't be what Trump is actually doing.


Duly noted. Usually I just follow the way the potential answers are presented in the poll but that would be more sensible for this question.

Ja D said...

Good news.